| Author |
Message |
pete
Guest
|
 Posted:
Thu Nov 25, 2004 12:02 am Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 09:20:10 -0000, "Grant" <news@mason.sh> wrote:
| Quote: | http://www.igo.com/Product_Detail.asp?ProductCode=MOB+PS0055-11
I use one of these to power my laptop in the office, car and plane - works
well. £99 from Dixons - got mine for £45 from ebay.
Kensington also do something similar.
|
That is it entirely. It is the perfect solution and I am very grateful
for your post. Thanks.
pete
|
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|
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pete
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Nov 25, 2004 12:07 am Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
On 24 Nov 2004 12:59:30 GMT, Frank Kemper <spam-muelleimer@gmx.de>
wrote:
| Quote: | pete <peterturtill@hotmail.com> haute in die Tasten:
There are three ways to charge a laptop in a car:
1. Buy a 12V-220V converter (110V pobably also available) and plug it into your
cigarette lighter. Plug the AC power adapter into the converter and into the laptop.
Advantage: Universal high voltage source, which can also be used to run an electric
shaver or something like that. Disadvantages: Power output usually is quite low and may
be insufficient to simultaneously power your notebook and charge its battery. And you
have quite a lot of cables and boxes around in your car. I have one, it is too weak to
charge my battery and run the notebook at once and it cost me some 80 Euros.
2. Buy a 12 V car adapter offered as officially certified accessory by the manufacturer
of yur notebook. This will work perfectly, and you will have a warranty that it won't
harm your notebook. Disadvantage: The price often is ridiculous
3. Buy an aftermarket car charger for your notebook. For that you should find out how
many watts your notebook draws from the AC power source in worst case. The power output
of the car charger device should be substantially above that. Do not buy an unit which
is not dedicated for usage with notebooks: it is neccessary that the voltage of the
charger is stabilized and accurate. Advantage: Usually cheaper than OEM accessory, in
most cases fitted with different plugs and a voltage dialer, so it is a kind of an
universal power source. Disadvantage: usually bulkier and you have the chance of mis-
handling it (wrong plug, wrong voltage, not enough watts).
Hope that helps
|
I have been asking this question for a week now on other ng's without
a good answer yet alone one as comprehensive as your post and the
other folk on this ng and I am very grateful to all for the help I
have received. Many thanks Frank for your post.
pete |
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Ash
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Nov 25, 2004 12:58 pm Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
"pete" <peterturtill@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:tam9q0dhqbeq29n1ajvukqhq76fjsllr7i@4ax.com...
| Quote: |
Thanks Ashley but I am now investigating a straight forward hook up as
mentioned by Matt.
pete
|
Hi Pete,
No problem . Id get some twin core and run it directly to the battery and
place an inline fuse into it. Or if you wanted it to only run with ignition
find the best hefty switched supply at the steering column on the ignition
switch, likewise place an inline fuse into it.
Hope my 2 pence is of some use.
Cheers
Ashley
|
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pete
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Nov 25, 2004 5:43 pm Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
On Thu, 25 Nov 2004 07:58:14 -0000, "Ash"
<ashley@NOSPAMwana.NOSPAMNET> wrote:
| Quote: |
"pete" <peterturtill@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:tam9q0dhqbeq29n1ajvukqhq76fjsllr7i@4ax.com...
Thanks Ashley but I am now investigating a straight forward hook up as
mentioned by Matt.
pete
Hi Pete,
No problem . Id get some twin core and run it directly to the battery and
place an inline fuse into it. Or if you wanted it to only run with ignition
find the best hefty switched supply at the steering column on the ignition
switch, likewise place an inline fuse into it.
|
Yes thanks Ashley. I am thinking about having a special connection
made up for it.
smicker |
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Dave Plowman (News)
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 29, 2004 6:59 pm Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
In article <10qmq9equhok722@corp.supernews.com>,
Jeff Strickland <spamcatcher@yahoo.net> wrote:
| Quote: | I used an inverter to run a lap top for about one year.
What was the inverter make and rating then please? pete
|
| Quote: | Sorry, I don't remember exaqctly what size it was, but I think it was
about 400 watts, which works out to about 3.75 amps, which is enough to
run a laptop.
|
I'd hope so. ;-)
Lap tops can usually be run from batteries, and if they really did take
400 watts those batteries would be somewhat larger than the lap top for a
reasonable life.
To put it in perspective, a car battery of 70 amp/hr - a fairly normal
size - wouldn't manage 400 watts for 2 hours.
--
*Why do we say something is out of whack? What is a whack? *
Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
|
| Back to top |
|
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Jeff Strickland
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 29, 2004 11:19 pm Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
"pete" <peterturtill@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8su7q0t5mtslhfk5qj2i6ue1s453qhqjj2@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 17:17:37 -0800, "Jeff Strickland"
spamcatcher@yahoo.net> wrote:
I used an inverter to run a lap top for about one year.
What was the inverter make and rating then please?
pete
|
Sorry, I don't remember exaqctly what size it was, but I think it was about
400 watts, which works out to about 3.75 amps, which is enough to run a
laptop. Look on the power supply of your lap top for the input requirements,
then multiply that number by 110 to get the wattage rating. If you need 5
amps, and you get 110 volts, then (amps x volts = power, or watts). 5 x 110
= 550 watts, in this case you would be OK with 500 watts, but would probably
be better served by 600 watts. Either of these would draw less than the fuse
rating of the cigar lighter in your car. The rating of this kind of stuff -
laptops and other kinds of loads - is generally expressed in AMPS, but power
supplies typically generate power in WATTS, so we have to convert from one
to the other to be sure we buy the right generation system, or avoid loading
it down with too many loads. W / V = A, where W is watts, V is volts, and A
is amps.
There are actually letters to ascribe to each of these variables, but I see
no point in confusing the matter, simply divide the power in watts
(displayed prominently on the box) by the voltage provided, and the result
is the max load, in amps, that can be supported. The same formula works no
matter if the voltage is 110vAC or 12vDC.
I found mine at Radio Shack, but they carry them at WalMart and other fine
discount houses. |
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|
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Dave Plowman (News)
Guest
|
| Posted:
Tue Nov 30, 2004 12:16 am Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
In article <cRMqd.85268$vO1.495087@nnrp1.uunet.ca>,
Somebody <somebody@nospam.russdoucet.com> wrote:
| Quote: | My laptop's power supply says input is 1.5A at 120 volts and output is
4.6A at 19V.
|
To get watts - multiply volts by amps. So 4.6 amps at 19 volts makes 87
watts. But this will be a peak current consumption - not average. The
maximum power consumption from the mains will be 120 x 1.5 = 180 watts,
which takes into account the losses in the charger/power supply. It
probably also allows the batteries to be on charge while the lap top is in
use.
| Quote: | What size inverter would I need? How would an E30 lighter socket do with
such a load?
|
The normal peak load for a lighter socket is 10 amps - so about 120 watts.
Which should happily run any lap top.
--
*Husbands should come with instructions
Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Somebody
Guest
|
| Posted:
Tue Nov 30, 2004 2:51 am Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
"Dave Plowman (News)" <dave@davenoise.co.uk> wrote in message
news:4d1591c92bdave@davenoise.co.uk...
| Quote: | In article <10qmq9equhok722@corp.supernews.com>,
Jeff Strickland <spamcatcher@yahoo.net> wrote:
I used an inverter to run a lap top for about one year.
What was the inverter make and rating then please? pete
Sorry, I don't remember exaqctly what size it was, but I think it was
about 400 watts, which works out to about 3.75 amps, which is enough to
run a laptop.
I'd hope so. ;-)
Lap tops can usually be run from batteries, and if they really did take
400 watts those batteries would be somewhat larger than the lap top for a
reasonable life.
To put it in perspective, a car battery of 70 amp/hr - a fairly normal
size - wouldn't manage 400 watts for 2 hours.
|
My laptop's power supply says input is 1.5A at 120 volts and output is 4.6A
at 19V.
What size inverter would I need? How would an E30 lighter socket do with
such a load?
-Russ. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
pete
Guest
|
| Posted:
Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:46 am Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 10:19:27 -0800, "Jeff Strickland"
<spamcatcher@yahoo.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
"pete" <peterturtill@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8su7q0t5mtslhfk5qj2i6ue1s453qhqjj2@4ax.com...
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 17:17:37 -0800, "Jeff Strickland"
spamcatcher@yahoo.net> wrote:
I used an inverter to run a lap top for about one year.
What was the inverter make and rating then please?
pete
Sorry, I don't remember exaqctly what size it was, but I think it was about
400 watts, which works out to about 3.75 amps, which is enough to run a
laptop. Look on the power supply of your lap top for the input requirements,
then multiply that number by 110 to get the wattage rating. If you need 5
amps, and you get 110 volts, then (amps x volts = power, or watts). 5 x 110
= 550 watts, in this case you would be OK with 500 watts, but would probably
be better served by 600 watts. Either of these would draw less than the fuse
rating of the cigar lighter in your car. The rating of this kind of stuff -
laptops and other kinds of loads - is generally expressed in AMPS, but power
supplies typically generate power in WATTS, so we have to convert from one
to the other to be sure we buy the right generation system, or avoid loading
it down with too many loads. W / V = A, where W is watts, V is volts, and A
is amps.
There are actually letters to ascribe to each of these variables, but I see
no point in confusing the matter, simply divide the power in watts
(displayed prominently on the box) by the voltage provided, and the result
is the max load, in amps, that can be supported. The same formula works no
matter if the voltage is 110vAC or 12vDC.
I found mine at Radio Shack, but they carry them at WalMart and other fine
discount houses.
|
That is too complicated for me unfortunately as we have 220v AC here
and I have decided to use a direct connection device once the new lap
top arrives later this week and this pc and the lap top will be
changed to run on XP home. Thanks for your post.
pete |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Aldo Larrabiata
Guest
|
| Posted:
Wed Dec 01, 2004 2:00 am Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
Hi Dave,
"Dave Plowman (News)" <dave@davenoise.co.uk> a écrit dans le message news:
4d15aed2cadave@davenoise.co.uk...
| Quote: | In article <cRMqd.85268$vO1.495087@nnrp1.uunet.ca>,
Somebody <somebody@nospam.russdoucet.com> wrote:
My laptop's power supply says input is 1.5A at 120 volts and output is
4.6A at 19V.
To get watts - multiply volts by amps. So 4.6 amps at 19 volts makes 87
watts. But this will be a peak current consumption - not average.
|
I think you want to say maximum average value (worst case) instead of peak.
Apologies for the formalism !
| Quote: | maximum power consumption from the mains will be 120 x 1.5 = 180 watts,
which takes into account the losses in the charger/power supply.
|
.... And the power factor. The AC/DC is probably built around an input bridge
rectifier feeding a big electrolytic capacitor without form factor
correction. This means capacitive current. 180 are VA (appearent power), not
Watts. With a severe form factor of 0.65 (cos phi) and 25% losses (rather
good converter), you reach the 87 Watts delivered to the computer
| Quote: | probably also allows the batteries to be on charge while the lap top is in
use.
What size inverter would I need? How would an E30 lighter socket do
with
such a load?
|
Have a look on the wires connected to the cigarette lighter. Should normally
be 1 to 1.5 mm² for 5 to 10 Amps. Look as well at its protecting fuse.
They will give you the power capability of the line and its ability to
sustain the continuous current.
Should you need 180 VA, to determine the battery current, you have to make
the reverse computation.
180/efficiency = roughly the power on the 12V side. Let assume the
efficiency is also 75%, you'll need 240W. This means 20 Amps !
Probably out of range of the cigarette lighter.
Better to supply the computer by a dedicated inverter. You save 50% of the
power. 115 W (DC side) would be enough.
| Quote: | The normal peak load for a lighter socket is 10 amps - so about 120 watts.
|
Yes, the lighter isn't intended for continuous use. I'd bet it's rated 5
Amps continuous 10 Amps intermittent use. The socket's spring releases with
the heating (it's designed for this purpose) resulting in poor contacts in
case of intensive use.
| Quote: | Which should happily run any lap top.
|
but not for the lighter own comfort in case of an inverter followed by the
computer AC/DC !
It would just fit however with a 12 / 19 V inverter. Also, I'd be careful.
Value analysis is everywhere and gauge reduction for money and mass saving
is omnipresent even in the Bimmers.
My opinion is that a DC/AC inverter followed by an AC/DC converter is not a
good solution unless they are hard-wired to the battery with a dedicated
protected line because of the very poor efficiency resulting in high
dissipation everywhere, first within the car harness and second also due to
bad cooling if the converters are placed on the rugs.
A dedicated inverter is smaller, its self heating is pretty low, making it
more easy to be cooled. The better input current makes it more versatile and
safer wrt to any vehicle harness. Of course this is a rule of the thumb.
| Quote: | --
*Husbands should come with instructions
Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
|
Regards |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jeff Strickland
Guest
|
| Posted:
Wed Dec 01, 2004 5:40 am Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
"pete" <peterturtill@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:dvcnq05njnp1ddpubjtn2lj5kv99su6ldp@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 10:19:27 -0800, "Jeff Strickland"
spamcatcher@yahoo.net> wrote:
"pete" <peterturtill@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8su7q0t5mtslhfk5qj2i6ue1s453qhqjj2@4ax.com...
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 17:17:37 -0800, "Jeff Strickland"
spamcatcher@yahoo.net> wrote:
I used an inverter to run a lap top for about one year.
What was the inverter make and rating then please?
pete
Sorry, I don't remember exaqctly what size it was, but I think it was
about
400 watts, which works out to about 3.75 amps, which is enough to run a
laptop. Look on the power supply of your lap top for the input
requirements,
then multiply that number by 110 to get the wattage rating. If you need 5
amps, and you get 110 volts, then (amps x volts = power, or watts). 5 x
110
= 550 watts, in this case you would be OK with 500 watts, but would
probably
be better served by 600 watts. Either of these would draw less than the
fuse
rating of the cigar lighter in your car. The rating of this kind of
stuff -
laptops and other kinds of loads - is generally expressed in AMPS, but
power
supplies typically generate power in WATTS, so we have to convert from
one
to the other to be sure we buy the right generation system, or avoid
loading
it down with too many loads. W / V = A, where W is watts, V is volts, and
A
is amps.
There are actually letters to ascribe to each of these variables, but I
see
no point in confusing the matter, simply divide the power in watts
(displayed prominently on the box) by the voltage provided, and the
result
is the max load, in amps, that can be supported. The same formula works
no
matter if the voltage is 110vAC or 12vDC.
I found mine at Radio Shack, but they carry them at WalMart and other
fine
discount houses.
That is too complicated for me unfortunately as we have 220v AC here
and I have decided to use a direct connection device once the new lap
top arrives later this week and this pc and the lap top will be
changed to run on XP home. Thanks for your post.
pete
|
220 or 110 doesn't matter. The numbers come out different, but the means of
arriving at them is the same. You will get 2.5A from 550W @ 220V. If you can
find an inverter that has a cigar lighter plug for your car, and it produces
from 200 to 400 watts, it will operate your laptop just fine.
They sell these inverters at the larger retail stores that handle
electronics. I suppose the store that carries your computer will also carry
the inverter. In America, we have BestBuy, Circuit City, WalMart, Target,
etc., ad naseum that carry a wide selection of electronics, these are the
kinds of stores that will carry the inverter. I don't know the names of the
"big box" stores where you are, so I can't give a suggestion other than to
describe the names of what we have and hope you recognize their business
model, then match it to what you have available. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jeff Strickland
Guest
|
| Posted:
Wed Dec 01, 2004 5:40 am Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
"Somebody" <somebody@nospam.russdoucet.com> wrote in message
news:cRMqd.85268$vO1.495087@nnrp1.uunet.ca...
| Quote: |
"Dave Plowman (News)" <dave@davenoise.co.uk> wrote in message
news:4d1591c92bdave@davenoise.co.uk...
In article <10qmq9equhok722@corp.supernews.com>,
Jeff Strickland <spamcatcher@yahoo.net> wrote:
I used an inverter to run a lap top for about one year.
What was the inverter make and rating then please? pete
Sorry, I don't remember exaqctly what size it was, but I think it was
about 400 watts, which works out to about 3.75 amps, which is enough
to
run a laptop.
I'd hope so. ;-)
Lap tops can usually be run from batteries, and if they really did take
400 watts those batteries would be somewhat larger than the lap top for
a
reasonable life.
To put it in perspective, a car battery of 70 amp/hr - a fairly normal
size - wouldn't manage 400 watts for 2 hours.
My laptop's power supply says input is 1.5A at 120 volts and output is
4.6A
at 19V.
What size inverter would I need? How would an E30 lighter socket do with
such a load?
-Russ.
You would need an inverter that produces 165 watts. This is an odd number, |
you would probably find 200 watts. This will satisfy your power supply for
your computer, and the car will be able to handle it easily. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dave Plowman (News)
Guest
|
| Posted:
Wed Dec 01, 2004 11:00 am Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
In article <41acdf7e$0$30435$8fcfb975@news.wanadoo.fr>,
Aldo Larrabiata <duschmoll@racer.com> wrote:
| Quote: | To get watts - multiply volts by amps. So 4.6 amps at 19 volts makes 87
watts. But this will be a peak current consumption - not average.
I think you want to say maximum average value (worst case) instead of
peak. Apologies for the formalism !
|
Perhaps it's a language thing, but peak means just that - the absolute
maximum.
| Quote: | maximum power consumption from the mains will be 120 x 1.5 = 180 watts,
which takes into account the losses in the charger/power supply.
... And the power factor. The AC/DC is probably built around an input
bridge rectifier feeding a big electrolytic capacitor without form
factor correction. This means capacitive current. 180 are VA (appearent
power), not Watts. With a severe form factor of 0.65 (cos phi) and 25%
losses (rather good converter), you reach the 87 Watts delivered to the
computer
|
I'd say it's almost certainly a SMPS type rather than a 'plain' PS. A 5
Amp at 19 volts conventional unit would be pretty large.
I'd also say the 1.5 Amps at 110 v is just an approximation - any supply
that consumed 180 watts for an output of 87 would get very hot indeed.
--
*Honk if you love peace and quiet.
Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
pete
Guest
|
| Posted:
Wed Dec 01, 2004 7:30 pm Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 18:48:53 -0800, "Jeff Strickland"
<spamcatcher@yahoo.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
"pete" <peterturtill@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:dvcnq05njnp1ddpubjtn2lj5kv99su6ldp@4ax.com...
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 10:19:27 -0800, "Jeff Strickland"
spamcatcher@yahoo.net> wrote:
"pete" <peterturtill@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8su7q0t5mtslhfk5qj2i6ue1s453qhqjj2@4ax.com...
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 17:17:37 -0800, "Jeff Strickland"
spamcatcher@yahoo.net> wrote:
I used an inverter to run a lap top for about one year.
What was the inverter make and rating then please?
pete
Sorry, I don't remember exaqctly what size it was, but I think it was
about
400 watts, which works out to about 3.75 amps, which is enough to run a
laptop. Look on the power supply of your lap top for the input
requirements,
then multiply that number by 110 to get the wattage rating. If you need 5
amps, and you get 110 volts, then (amps x volts = power, or watts). 5 x
110
= 550 watts, in this case you would be OK with 500 watts, but would
probably
be better served by 600 watts. Either of these would draw less than the
fuse
rating of the cigar lighter in your car. The rating of this kind of
stuff -
laptops and other kinds of loads - is generally expressed in AMPS, but
power
supplies typically generate power in WATTS, so we have to convert from
one
to the other to be sure we buy the right generation system, or avoid
loading
it down with too many loads. W / V = A, where W is watts, V is volts, and
A
is amps.
There are actually letters to ascribe to each of these variables, but I
see
no point in confusing the matter, simply divide the power in watts
(displayed prominently on the box) by the voltage provided, and the
result
is the max load, in amps, that can be supported. The same formula works
no
matter if the voltage is 110vAC or 12vDC.
I found mine at Radio Shack, but they carry them at WalMart and other
fine
discount houses.
That is too complicated for me unfortunately as we have 220v AC here
and I have decided to use a direct connection device once the new lap
top arrives later this week and this pc and the lap top will be
changed to run on XP home. Thanks for your post.
pete
220 or 110 doesn't matter. The numbers come out different, but the means of
arriving at them is the same. You will get 2.5A from 550W @ 220V. If you can
find an inverter that has a cigar lighter plug for your car, and it produces
from 200 to 400 watts, it will operate your laptop just fine.
They sell these inverters at the larger retail stores that handle
electronics. I suppose the store that carries your computer will also carry
the inverter. In America, we have BestBuy, Circuit City, WalMart, Target,
etc., ad naseum that carry a wide selection of electronics, these are the
kinds of stores that will carry the inverter. I don't know the names of the
"big box" stores where you are, so I can't give a suggestion other than to
describe the names of what we have and hope you recognize their business
model, then match it to what you have available.
|
I have seen a couple of stores where they have direct connections that
can be adjusted for lap tops mobile phones etc but both of them were
in the USA so now I will look around for the same thing in th UK
thanks.
pete |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jeff Strickland
Guest
|
| Posted:
Wed Dec 01, 2004 10:25 pm Post subject:
Re: Using an inverter to charge lap top. |
|
|
"pete" <peterturtill@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:r6lrq0p8p2v0oookhc6ough6hhu3l94m6n@4ax.com...
| Quote: | 220 or 110 doesn't matter. The numbers come out different, but the means
of
arriving at them is the same. You will get 2.5A from 550W @ 220V. If you
can
find an inverter that has a cigar lighter plug for your car, and it
produces
from 200 to 400 watts, it will operate your laptop just fine.
They sell these inverters at the larger retail stores that handle
electronics. I suppose the store that carries your computer will also
carry
the inverter. In America, we have BestBuy, Circuit City, WalMart, Target,
etc., ad naseum that carry a wide selection of electronics, these are the
kinds of stores that will carry the inverter. I don't know the names of
the
"big box" stores where you are, so I can't give a suggestion other than
to
describe the names of what we have and hope you recognize their business
model, then match it to what you have available.
I have seen a couple of stores where they have direct connections that
can be adjusted for lap tops mobile phones etc but both of them were
in the USA so now I will look around for the same thing in th UK
thanks.
pete
|
I forgot to mention the obvious; here in the Colonies we have a store called
Radio Shack. It sells all manner of electronic gadgets, stuff you can glue
and solder together yourself to build a radio. It also sells inverters. Take
your laptop in, and they will set you up with an inverter of the proper
capacity. Your car won't mind one bit. |
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