| Author |
Message |
GRL
Guest
|
 Posted:
Wed Dec 22, 2004 7:52 am Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
Oh, please, lay of the baloney. BMW handling is very good, but it is NOT
light years ahead of other good sedans and sports coupes, just a little and
other that little has to do with the other brand being tuned more for
performance or more for handling. Examples, a Lexus IS300 (or a Subaru STi)
has better handing than a 3-Series, but inferior ride comfort. A 540i BMW
has better handling than an LS430, but inferior ride comfort.
I test drove G35, STi, IS300, 330i (sport and ZHP), 330ix and 330ci this
past summer. The Bimmers were a bit better overall, but the IS300 and STi
were better handlers, the STi by a LOT. The non-Bimmers just did not offer
as good a compromise as the 3-Series cars did. I bought a 330i ZHP, as a
result, and I like it a lot, but I know damn well that it is not
dramatically better than the rest, just a little. And it definitely has its
own design problems (ridiculously long clutch throw, a pathetic excuse for
short shift linkage, are annoyances that come to mind) and is not nearly the
fun or as engaging to drive as the STi was, but still plenty of fun. But I
wanted a compromise, and it was the best in that regard.
It will be interesting to see what the IS350 will be like when it comes out
next year. Lexus showed with the IS300 that they can build a very good
sports sedan that is almost BMW 3-Series quality (ride/handling) in the
first iteration. Be interesting to see how much, if any, they improve it in
iteration two. Of course BMW will have the new Banglized 3-Series out by
then. Make for an interesting comparison.
- GRL
"Malt_Hound" <Malt_Hound@*spam*yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:8sOdnUipGOu38lXcRVn-vQ@adelphia.com...
| Quote: | dizzy wrote:
A BMW suspension is lightyears from asian cars in terms of performance.
Yes, it can be more finicky about things such as transmitting
vibration from out of balance wheels or loose bushings or ball-joints.
But when everything is tight, there is just no comparison.
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Dori A Schmetterling
Guest
|
| Posted:
Wed Dec 22, 2004 6:35 pm Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
Your thoughts tempted fate. Don't think :-)
DAS
--
For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling
---
"marlin" <marlinspike.nospam@verizon.net.nospam> wrote in message
news:i94yd.2824$_62.2652@trnddc01...
| Quote: | So here I am thinking, well my 1998 540 has never had a single repair done
to it, then bam, the radiator neck broke. Gosh darn it.
Richard
[...] |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dori A Schmetterling
Guest
|
| Posted:
Wed Dec 22, 2004 6:43 pm Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
Obviously...
Some years ago I used to received the monthly magazine published by
Germany's largest motoring organisation (ADAC) with millions of members.
Every year they published their call-out statistics (probably still do)
divided by class of car (small, lower middle class etc) and by type of fault
etc.
For inclusion a particular brand/model had to have minimum annual sales of
10 000.
Now one can argue about the type of normalisation but one of the conclusions
was stark and the same every year I saw the figures. In every class where
the Japanese were represented they were always the most reliable. I think
it was Nissan, Toyota and Mazda (don't recall the order, which may have have
varied across the classes).
At that time the Japanese were not in the top class, so it was BMW or Merc
at the top. As Audi now have taken an increasing share of the top market
and the Japanese have more models the situation may well have changed
substantally.
DAS
--
For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling
---
"Jim Levie" <jim@entrophy-free.net> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.12.21.04.34.46.582768@entrophy-free.net...
[...]
| Quote: |
No car is ever going to be "maintenance free".
[...] |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dizzy
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Dec 23, 2004 4:39 am Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
On Mon, 20 Dec 2004 20:06:00 -0500, "GRL" <GLitwinski@CHARTERMI.NET>
wrote:
| Quote: | OK, I'll give you the reply I always get when I bitch and moan about BMW
reliability (vs. Japanese cars).
BMW's are complex masterworks of Germanic engineering/art that require
careful maintenance and you should feel honored that you are allowed to own
one instead of just a car.
This is in contrast to simple devices like, say, Honda S2000's or Subaru
Sti's or Toyota MR2's or Acura NSX's that never seem to break because they
do not have the benefit of precision German engineering.
Tough it out, I say...and quit your whining.
|
Not sure what to make of this post, whether it's serious or sarcastic.
In any case, I think it's exactly correct. 8) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dizzy
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Dec 23, 2004 4:45 am Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
On Mon, 20 Dec 2004 23:10:17 -0500, "Deep"
<deep_mehtaHATESSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: | You know, I was GUNG HO about my BMW when I got it - More so since a family
member works at BMW's head office in Canada and thought I would get a great
car.
Well, I do have a great car. Just a great car that will never be maintenance
free. I've learned that the hard way.
(snip)
You basically have to stick it out, or get rid of it.
|
Oh, it's not that bad. I expected going-in that it was going to be
more expensive to own than a Honda (duh). And I believe that the
fragility of the BMW front suspension is for a reason - for example
low unsprung weight. In all, the car is probably better than I
expected it was going to be, as far as reliability is concerned. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dizzy
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Dec 23, 2004 4:49 am Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 12:48:29 GMT, "marlin"
<marlinspike.nospam@verizon.net.nospam> wrote:
| Quote: | "dizzy" <dizzy@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
news:2ores0tesamjb07soa01htevun6gvd86tv@4ax.com...
Took my car in for "inspection 2", plus to have the thermostat
replaced (second one to fail in only 55k miles). Can you guys make a
thermostat that works, BMW?
Strange, the only one I had that wasn't good was one that the dealer put in
because there was some recall made (no, not part of that whole I-6's
catching fire thing), but the replacement was burred, either way both were
free. How often are you changing your coolant?
|
I've just been following the BMW plan... Had two thermostats
replaced, so there's some new coolant right there... 8)
| Quote: | They tell me that the lower control arms have too much play as well -
not surprising, I've noticed a bit of a shimmy at times.
I think they're giving you the business. The shimmy will go away with a tire
balancing. BMWs like to throw tires in and out of balance.
|
Maybe. I'm putting that job off until Spring, at least. With my
Winter wheels, no problem with shimmy. Maybe my Summer 17's need a
balance. I'd like to try one of those "on car" balance jobs I've
heard about. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dizzy
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Dec 23, 2004 4:51 am Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 22:27:26 -0500, "GRL" <GLitwinski@CHARTERMI.NET>
wrote:
| Quote: | Oh, please, lay of the baloney. BMW handling is very good, but it is NOT
light years ahead of other good sedans and sports coupes, just a little and
other that little has to do with the other brand being tuned more for
performance or more for handling. Examples, a Lexus IS300 (or a Subaru STi)
has better handing than a 3-Series, but inferior ride comfort. A 540i BMW
has better handling than an LS430, but inferior ride comfort.
|
Yes. BMW has the best ride/handling compromise. The best all-around
game, if you will. That's what you're paying the big money for (at
least in my case). |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dizzy
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Dec 23, 2004 4:52 am Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 01:33:02 GMT, "marlin"
<marlinspike.nospam@verizon.net.nospam> wrote:
| Quote: | So here I am thinking, well my 1998 540 has never had a single repair done
to it, then bam, the radiator neck broke. Gosh darn it.
Richard
|
Hehe. Sorry, but that's funny. "Gosh darn it." |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Deep
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Dec 23, 2004 5:46 am Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
Mine's alot less reliable than I expected.... I had a funny start the other
day when it was extreme cold. The car started then I noticed a violent shake
in the car to start and the check engine light came on. "here we go
again..." I thought. On a whim, I shut off the engine and waited 10 seconds
and started again. No problems. and none since. Of all my cars, no matter
how cold, they've never done that.
Deep
"dizzy" <dizzy@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
news:uo1ks0pc3qc97gptjb0dl7vv3kqrirslvu@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On Mon, 20 Dec 2004 23:10:17 -0500, "Deep"
deep_mehtaHATESSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote:
You know, I was GUNG HO about my BMW when I got it - More so since a
family
member works at BMW's head office in Canada and thought I would get a
great
car.
Well, I do have a great car. Just a great car that will never be
maintenance
free. I've learned that the hard way.
(snip)
You basically have to stick it out, or get rid of it.
Oh, it's not that bad. I expected going-in that it was going to be
more expensive to own than a Honda (duh). And I believe that the
fragility of the BMW front suspension is for a reason - for example
low unsprung weight. In all, the car is probably better than I
expected it was going to be, as far as reliability is concerned.
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Malt_Hound
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Dec 23, 2004 6:21 am Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
Deep wrote:
| Quote: | Mine's alot less reliable than I expected.... I had a funny start the other
day when it was extreme cold. The car started then I noticed a violent shake
in the car to start and the check engine light came on. "here we go
again..." I thought. On a whim, I shut off the engine and waited 10 seconds
and started again. No problems. and none since. Of all my cars, no matter
how cold, they've never done that.
Well, you can't say that anymore. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
GRL
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Dec 23, 2004 7:49 am Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
Should have been "...lay off the baloney...". Typo. Sorry.
- GRL
"GRL" <GLitwinski@CHARTERMI.NET> wrote in message
news:ZU5yd.2989$%O6.2784@fe03.lga...
| Quote: | Oh, please, lay of the baloney. BMW handling is very good, but it is NOT
light years ahead of other good sedans and sports coupes, just a little
and
other that little has to do with the other brand being tuned more for
performance or more for handling. Examples, a Lexus IS300 (or a Subaru
STi)
has better handing than a 3-Series, but inferior ride comfort. A 540i BMW
has better handling than an LS430, but inferior ride comfort.
I test drove G35, STi, IS300, 330i (sport and ZHP), 330ix and 330ci this
past summer. The Bimmers were a bit better overall, but the IS300 and STi
were better handlers, the STi by a LOT. The non-Bimmers just did not offer
as good a compromise as the 3-Series cars did. I bought a 330i ZHP, as a
result, and I like it a lot, but I know damn well that it is not
dramatically better than the rest, just a little. And it definitely has
its
own design problems (ridiculously long clutch throw, a pathetic excuse for
short shift linkage, are annoyances that come to mind) and is not nearly
the
fun or as engaging to drive as the STi was, but still plenty of fun. But I
wanted a compromise, and it was the best in that regard.
It will be interesting to see what the IS350 will be like when it comes
out
next year. Lexus showed with the IS300 that they can build a very good
sports sedan that is almost BMW 3-Series quality (ride/handling) in the
first iteration. Be interesting to see how much, if any, they improve it
in
iteration two. Of course BMW will have the new Banglized 3-Series out by
then. Make for an interesting comparison.
- GRL
"Malt_Hound" <Malt_Hound@*spam*yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:8sOdnUipGOu38lXcRVn-vQ@adelphia.com...
dizzy wrote:
A BMW suspension is lightyears from asian cars in terms of performance.
Yes, it can be more finicky about things such as transmitting
vibration from out of balance wheels or loose bushings or ball-joints.
But when everything is tight, there is just no comparison.
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Deep
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Dec 23, 2004 7:54 am Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
It's like talking to a deaf person in here... I say I like my car and the
joy I get driving it - but I'm unhappy with the reliability and to top it
all off the service cost of the dealerships and I still get snarky
remarks...
Deep
"Malt_Hound" <Malt_Hound@*spam*yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3_ednf6sAaISgFfcRVn-pA@adelphia.com...
| Quote: | Deep wrote:
Mine's alot less reliable than I expected.... I had a funny start the
other
day when it was extreme cold. The car started then I noticed a violent
shake
in the car to start and the check engine light came on. "here we go
again..." I thought. On a whim, I shut off the engine and waited 10
seconds
and started again. No problems. and none since. Of all my cars, no
matter
how cold, they've never done that.
Well, you can't say that anymore. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dave Plowman (News)
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Dec 23, 2004 1:48 pm Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
In article <vvals0db2scr9qtdou8ud7is01q1bb780g@4ax.com>,
dizzy <dizzy@nospam.invalid> wrote:
| Quote: | It would be nice, though, if the bushing are "wear items", that they
were more easily/cheaply replaceable...
|
Well, yes. But be thankful you don't have to take out the engine to
replace the cambelt every 30,000 miles like some cars. ;-)
--
*Forget the Joneses, I keep us up with the Simpsons.
Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dizzy
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Dec 23, 2004 4:26 pm Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:00:06 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
<dave@davenoise.co.uk> wrote:
| Quote: | In the quest for refinement, bushes are made as compliant as possible
while retaining good location. This unfortunately translates into shorter
life.
|
Just like the brakes - wonderful feel, very short life, for both pad
and rotor.
| Quote: | The design of the suspension is also way more complicated than the most
basic strut type. This is the price you pay for the superb steering
handling ride compromise. You buy a BMW for these things and just accept
that it will cost more in maintenance. If you just want cheap wheels look
elsewhere - but then be prepared for a less rewarding driving experience.
|
It would be nice, though, if the bushing are "wear items", that they
were more easily/cheaply replaceable... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Stan Chang
Guest
|
| Posted:
Fri Dec 24, 2004 5:09 am Post subject:
Re: Small bitch about my 323 |
|
|
Snip
| Quote: | Maybe. I'm putting that job off until Spring, at least. With my
Winter wheels, no problem with shimmy. Maybe my Summer 17's need a
balance. I'd like to try one of those "on car" balance jobs I've
heard about.
|
I bought new rims and tires- from different sources, and had them shipped to
me last year. I originally went to a chain-store tire shop for mounting
and wasnt satisfied with the vibrations I was getting. I called the shop
back and they told me they did the best they could. So I sought out and
found a shop that uses the Hunter GSP 9000 Road Force Measurement System.
After all, Tire Rack (where I bought the tires) mounts their tires using
that system. The local shop using a Hunter GSP9000 found that two of my
brand new tires were out of spec. I called Tire Rack and in 2 days,
replacements were at my door. The local shop mounted them and my vibration
bitches went away.
They explained what they were doing while I watched then mount the tires.
Rather unusual in these days of being kept out of the shop due to Insurance
dictates. They told me the machine applies force to the tire on the rim and
detects inconsistencies in the tire. It also checks the rims for
inconsistencies. The machine allows them to match a "low spot" on the rim
with a "high spot" on the tire, reducing ride vibrations. They noted that
the rims today are getting better (closer to a perfect circle) which leaves
them less areas to countermatch rubber and rim inconsistencies. It was an
interesting afternoon.
Just my $.02.
Stan Chang
97 528iA
01 Z3 3.0L 5-spd |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
|
|
FAQ
Memberlist
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in