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Donnie Shortpants
Guest
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 Posted:
Tue Dec 06, 2005 9:14 am Post subject:
Re: Ford May Close 5 North American Plants |
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What do we do when we have to go to war with China, Depend on Mexico or
Korea to manufacture our tanks, Bradleys and other military vehicles.
Bring back all the smokestack industry .
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joe schmoe
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Dec 06, 2005 4:14 pm Post subject:
Re: Ford May Close 5 North American Plants |
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On Mon, 5 Dec 2005 23:31:56 -0800, DonnieShortpants@webtv.net (Donnie
Shortpants) wrote:
| Quote: | What do we do when we have to go to war with China, Depend on Mexico or
Korea to manufacture our tanks, Bradleys and other military vehicles.
Bring back all the smokestack industry .
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One only "needs" to go to war when you're trying to protect the past.
If one is moving to the future, other countries trying to get in on it
will assist and even open up to you. The Soviet Union didn't fall
because it didn't have enough smoke stack industries.
How many tank factories are in Switzerland?
When all the competent men in a country are armed trained soldiers
both the foreign enemies and the domestic government treat the
citizens with respect. (that was the logic behind the second
Amendment if I recall correctly).
Would the North Korean or Canadian governments treat it citizens with
such contempt if they knew the citizenry had the means and the will to
remove & replace the whole government structure? (Yes, I acknowledge
the Canadian problem is one of will power).
PS if there's ever a war between China and the US a hundred tank
factories wouldn't make a bit of difference, Tanks are somewhat
ineffectual against ICBM's |
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joe schmoe
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Dec 06, 2005 4:27 pm Post subject:
Re: time for coherent action! |
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On Mon, 05 Dec 2005 16:03:17 -0600, tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com
(Brent P) wrote:
| Quote: | snip
Shouldn't an engineer who does the same get his?
I saved an major US corporation I worked for aproximately $12,000,000.
What was my cut? 0. Zero. I would have gotten my salary and bonus by just
leaving the crap design I inherited in place and making it work, without
creatly a vastly less expensive and more reliable one.
snip
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I agree. I believe that years ago a number of companies implemented
an employee "suggestion box" that paid a percentage of net profits to
the person suggesting it. (if I recall GM had it in place for a
while) which worked rather well.
You should have gotten a cut, you may well have even done so if you
had documented what you had done, shopped out your services to
establish what you were worth to the company or others and asked for a
raise or gone to a company more interested in your services (i.e.
willing to pay more).
Shortly after I left high school I worked for a company that refused
to pay their top performing salesman above their maximum level
regardless of what he produced. He left, a year later the company
folded. He got his raise, the companies owner got the shaft for being
an idiot.
Unfortunately many CEO's wages are "determined" by a board stacked
with their friends. Makes it hard to constrain pay. However Enron,
World Com, Tyco and others have inadvertently done their part to bring
Board members into line. Watching Conrad Black of late has brightened
my days.
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Brent P
Guest
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| Posted:
Wed Dec 07, 2005 9:14 am Post subject:
Re: time for coherent action! |
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In article <7epap15l5g4vqro73th9pddbjgiio2011p@4ax.com>, joe schmoe wrote:
| Quote: | You should have gotten a cut, you may well have even done so if you
had documented what you had done, shopped out your services to
establish what you were worth to the company or others and asked for a
raise or gone to a company more interested in your services (i.e.
willing to pay more).
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You are correct, I've never been much of a braggart or one to do the
self promotion, more one who lets the work speak for itself and it
cost me politically in that environment.
| Quote: | Shortly after I left high school I worked for a company that refused
to pay their top performing salesman above their maximum level
regardless of what he produced. He left, a year later the company
folded. He got his raise, the companies owner got the shaft for being
an idiot.
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That's a nice difference between a publicly traded company and private
one. On a publically traded company it's almost impossible to shaft
someone like that.
| Quote: | Unfortunately many CEO's wages are "determined" by a board stacked
with their friends. Makes it hard to constrain pay.
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That's another factor that ticks people off about it that I had
forgotten. |
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Brent P
Guest
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| Posted:
Wed Dec 07, 2005 9:14 am Post subject:
Re: time for coherent action! |
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In article <au6lf.146179$Hs.57874@tornado.ohiordc.rr.com>, fclaugus wrote:
| Quote: | A good ceo is hard to get, and companies are willing to pay large high sums
if they believe it gives tham a competitive advantage.
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Sure... like the decisions the one of my now former employer made. He's
still got a job as do all the executives and senior management. (Today was
a surprise sacking day, about ~1/4-1/3 of the company I figure and half my
group gone and I was in the half that's now gone.) And that's what gets
people miffed. There is one senior executive who is mostly retired who
is still drawing a 80% of his salary (as I heard) from before he did
semi-retirement and wasn't sacked. His pay could have left probably 4-5
of the junior engineers in jobs or a couple of more senior engineers and
caused no impact to the company to have him just finish his fade out.
| Quote: | Such a performance arguement makes best sense if it's used across the
board. If people just get their salary / wage and some convouted bonus
based on company wide performance, that's all the CEO should get. If the
CEO gets paid for specific actions that effect the bottom line in a
commission type basis, so should everyone else.
A lot of perfessions would perfer to work for a salery rather than
comissions or performance bonuses. While thay might get paid more, their pay
will fluctuate more with too much uncertainty.
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CEOs don't just work for performance. They have base salaries. If CEO's
just worked for bottom line performance there may be less of a backlash.
I'd like that same deal that is always trotted out as an excuse for huge
CEO pay scales. I'd like a bonus that was actually tied to the dollar
amounts I added to the bottom line.
Another reason I believe it's valid to complain about CEOs is that they
have the power to manipulate things in the company to their own
personal favor and often do, sometimes at great cost to the rank and file.
| Quote: | If you really believe in the performance arguement I should have had a
least 1% of what I saved the company. I am sure the CEO got more than 1%.
I believe employees should be paid according to their impact on the bottom
line, and I do believe you deserved some sort of bonus for your efforts,
more than 1%, imo.
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Thanks :) |
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